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WikiSpecies notext-invert.svg Welcome to the village pump of Wikispecies.

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Village pump in other languages:

1 (2004-09-21/2005-01-05) 2 (2005-01-05/2005-08-23)
3 (2005-08-24/2005-12-31) 4 (2006-01-01/2005-05-31)
5 (2006-06-01/2006-12-16) 6 (2006-12-17/2006-12-31)
7 (2007-01-01/2007-02-28) 8 (2007-03-01/2007-04-30)
9 (2007-05-01/2007-08-31) 10 (2007-09-01/2007-10-31)
11 (2007-11-01/2007-12-31) 12 (2008-01-01/2008-02-28)
13 (2008-03-01/2008-04-28) 14 (2008-04-29/2008-06-30)
15 (2008-07-01/2008-09-30) 16 (2008-10-01/2008-12-25)
17 (2008-12-26/2009-02-28) 18 (2009-03-01/2009-06-30)
19 (2009-07-01/2009-12-31) 20 (2010-01-01/2010-06-30)
21 (2010-07-01/2010-12-31) 22 (2011-01-01/2011-06-30)
23 (2011-07-01/2011-12-31) 24 (2012-01-01/2012-12-31)
25 (2013-01-01/2013-12-31) 26 (2014-01-01/2014-12-31)
27 (2015-01-01/2015-01-31) 28 (2015-02-01/2015-02-28)
29 (2015-02-28/2015-04-29) 30 (2015-04-29/2015-07-19)
31 (2015-07-19/2015-09-23) 32 (2015-09-23/2015-11-21)
33 (2015-11-21/2015-12-31) 34 (2016-01-01/2016-04-17)
35 (2016-03-22/2016-05-01) 36 (2016-05-01/2016-07-12)
37 (2016-07-13/2016-09-30) 38 (2016-10-01/2016-12-04)
39 (2016-12-04/2017-01-17) 40 (2017-01-18/2017-01-28)
41 (2017-01-29/2017-02-13) 42 (2017-02-14/2017-03-21)
43 (2017-03-20/2017-08-11) 44 (2017-08-10/2017-12-07)
45 (2017-12-08/2018-01-08) 46 (2018-01-19/2018-03-11)
47 (2018-03-11/2018-09-11) 48 (2018-09-01/2019-02-17)
49 (2019-02-22/2019-...)

Help from outside[edit]

I've been in contact with an editor at PLAZI and I received today the following mail from him:

Dear Marius

Just to inform you that we are back on the extraction of Zootaxa, and other journals too. The goal is that we extract all the information you need, including type locality and the type.

In fact we export this information to speciesID and we could discuss how we could import this automatically into wikispecies?

Another issue is whether you have a list of journals that you use to extract data. If so, do you have a ranking of which are the most important in regards of the number of new species?

All the best, etc.

Any suggestions?? Mariusm (talk) 18:13, 2 April 2019 (UTC)

It would be very nice to be able to automatically import data from PLAZI into WS. Since speciesID is a wiki constructed similarly to WS, and since PLAZI editers know how to export data to it, there's no reason it can't be done similarly with WS. For example, today PLAZI published 976 species from Zootaxa. These same species can theoretically be also imported into WS in the appropriate WS structure. This will be an enormous boon for WS.
As for the most important journals in regards of the number of new species I think the list at is adequete, Can anyone add to this list? Mariusm (talk) 15:20, 3 April 2019 (UTC)
This data (not least speciesID identifiers, which seem to be taxon names, and for which a new property would be needed) should be added to Wikidata, from where it can be transcluded into Wikispecies. Note the existence of P1992, "Plazi ID", which facilitates this. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:05, 3 April 2019 (UTC)


Here are further exchanges with the PLAZI editor:

My mail:

Thanks for your willingness to help. There are a couple of issues to consider:

(1) WS is relatively strict on the format and content of its species pages. Can your bot produce a format similar to For example no "Description" or "Discussion" sections are allowed.

(2) You must be granted a bot permission from the WS community by a user poll. This necessitates a procedure involving communicating with the users and explaining the background and the scope of the bot. I'm willing to help with this, but the WS community will be expecting to communicate directly with the bot producer/operator, otherwise the bot acceptance is unlikely. I know this sounds tedious, but this is a communal site and a bot must pass an approval procedure. Please see

His mail:

Dear Marius
We can deal with 1. With 2 we won't be able an[d] need your input. We either spend our time liberating data or in distribution. At the moment we focus on the former and assure that at least all the data is in GBIF.
Why isn't your community acting on 2?
Best regards

Well, is it a dead end? Mariusm (talk) 13:58, 5 April 2019 (UTC)

No. See my reply to your first post in this section, above. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:20, 5 April 2019 (UTC)
See This for PLAZI-bot contributions to species-id. Mariusm (talk) 18:08, 7 April 2019 (UTC)
@Mariusm: Would it be possible for them to post a dozen pages here? Korg (talk) 19:00, 25 April 2019 (UTC)
@Korg: Thanks for your interest. I can ask, but I need some sort of a consensus to do that. I see here a total lack of enthusiasm to proceed with this any further, although I think this is a great opportunity to make WS grow and prosper. Mariusm (talk) 07:54, 26 April 2019 (UTC)
"...a total lack of enthusiasm to proceed..." Not so. Please refer to my reply to your first post in this section (to which you have not yet replied). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:51, 26 April 2019 (UTC)
@Mariusm: I understand, but in the meantime I think it would be interesting to have some concrete examples so people could form an opinion. Maybe with several examples we could generate some enthusiasm, and then go further. Korg (talk) 19:10, 26 April 2019 (UTC)
@Korg: For examples just look here. Species-id is wiki identical to WS and it uses the same software. The Plazi people are not permitted to run bots on WS, and asking them to modify their bot just for experimenting, will certainly be rejected. Mariusm (talk) 07:27, 27 April 2019 (UTC)
@Mariusm: Thanks. But how we could go further? Korg (talk) 21:49, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

A lot of data on species at russian Lomonosov Moscow State University resource[edit]


Thanks a lot for your work! World wouldnt be such a great place without wiki resources. I don't know how to contribute here, I'm not in biology at all, but i just found this data source.

Go here, pess ESC, then swtich to EN at the top right corner, for example mark the "Specimens with photo only" checbox on the popup window, click "OK". Then at the top ringt corner change a "Rows" to 1-20000 (max) and I bet you will be impressed how many rare species photos are availible there.

I bielive you could gather much more usefull information there, some of it choul be translated. Maybe somebody could contact MSU, but even if not, somehow we have to save this content before a possible isolation of russian net.

P.S. Other depositaries:

Thanks again, and sorry me for breaking your commetns publishing rules.

Regards, @sntxerror. — The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talkcontribs) 22:22, 12 April 2019‎.

Navigation popups[edit]

Now that I have "Interface admin" status, I have imported the "Navigation popups" gadget to this wiki; you can now enable it in your preferences. It is documented on en.Wikipedia, at en:Wikipedia:Tools/Navigation popups. I find it enhances my productivity on other projects greatly, and I'm confident it will do so here, too.

It doesn't look quite so pretty here; I'll work on tweaking the CSS, later. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 21:08, 21 April 2019 (UTC)

I love the popups. I've been using them on Wikispecies for years, but I really, really wish there was a convenient way for it to skip ahead to the name section, because the preview function for it is incredibly useless on taxa pages. Circeus (talk) 01:02, 22 April 2019 (UTC)


Have to be Synonymy after agreements.PeterR (talk) 12:11, 22 April 2019 (UTC)

But the edit tools still show int:Synonyms, of course. Andyboorman (talk) 20:07, 26 April 2019 (UTC)

New gadget: Links count[edit]

I have installed the gadget "Links count". This "counts total number of pages linked to a specific page on Special:WhatLinksHere (and transclusion, for templates)". Once activated, under "Preferences - gadgets", a "count" link is added in the "What links here" pane at the top of the Special:WhatLinksHere page. Just click that link to see the total. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 18:06, 25 April 2019 (UTC)

Eugen Karl Kempf[edit]

I just found out Tuesday that our ostracod editor Eugen Karl Kempf passed away in 2017, one day after his 85th birthday. Wikidata did not have this information, I have updated his author page. Neferkheperre (talk) 22:36, 25 April 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for the information. Professor Kempf started editing Wikispecies in May 2011, and soon became a very experienced user. In total he contributed with well over 8,000 edits. More than 2,400 of those were new pages, and he created his last Wikispecies page only one month before he sadly passed away. Best regards, Tommy Kronkvist (talk), 18:18, 2 May 2019 (UTC).



Cloud forest (talk) 10:55, 29 April 2019 (UTC)

Thank you[edit]


Cloud forest (talk) 07:19, 28 April 2019 (UTC)

@Cloud forest: Why have you posted this here? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 15:29, 28 April 2019 (UTC)
I rollebacked some of the edits because they aren't clear what this user is trying to convey. We might need to temporarily block this individual until we figure out what's going on. OhanaUnitedTalk page 02:05, 29 April 2019 (UTC)
Agreed. I have made an indefinite block, with an explanation at User talk:Cloud forest#Blocked. Any admin should feel free to unblock User:Cloud forest as soon as, but only if, the conditions there are met. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:39, 29 April 2019 (UTC)
Agree with block, whilst we seek explanation. I also do not get what the user is trying to accomplish. This is nothing but a list of names, I am not sure where they come from, ie the ref source, or what is being proposed with them. I did not check how different they are from current arrangements here. I would like to see explanations of where this is going from the user prior to any changes. Cheers Scott Thomson (Faendalimas) talk 18:00, 29 April 2019 (UTC)





Is there a solution? Thank you. Cloud forest (talk) 16:41, 28 April 2019 (UTC)

To what? Andyboorman (talk) 19:44, 28 April 2019 (UTC)

Adansonia, the (triple) journal[edit]

Right now, Adansonia the journal is only connected to ISSN 1280-8571. However, the IPNI data for that journal is... a bit of a mess that covers three, maybe four (!!!) distinct ISSNs. I have reformatted the current entry at ISSN 1280-8571 in a somewhat temporary fashion, but I suspect a proper Adansonia (journal) disambiguation page will have to be linked from Adansonia instead of a specific ISSN... Circeus (talk) 05:32, 29 April 2019 (UTC)

Indian Lepidoptera types[edit]

This new work may be of interest:

Help confirming the identity of the two "missing" authors (one also named as Suresh Kr. Shah,) would be appreciated, please. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:09, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

Shah is probably Suresh Kumar Shah ([1]). Sheela is more complicated. The S. initial is most likely a patronymic (Sheela is a female given name), the long form of which is often hard to dig up. Circeus (talk) 11:25, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
Could Sheela be the Saroj Sheela of AntWiki? Circeus (talk) 11:32, 2 May 2019 (UTC) I see you arrived at the same conclusion. I didn't even think of checking against her publications even though I'd opened that file at the ZSI site XD. Circeus (talk) 11:33, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
Thanks. All resolved, now. *mutters darkly about ORCID iDs* Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:48, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

Which Taylor?[edit]

Does anyone know the full name of "F.H. Taylor", author of Cydistomyia and other Horse-flies? None of the authors currently listed on the Taylor disambiguation page seems to fit. –Tommy Kronkvist (talk), 18:46, 2 May 2019 (UTC).

Taylor, Frank Henry (1886-1945)? See [2], [3] (different date of death), and Q55073137. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:27, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
Thank you! Tommy Kronkvist (talk), 21:32, 2 May 2019 (UTC).
Most contemporaneous newspapers and scientific journals states December 20, 1945 as the date of his death. See the newly created Frank Henry Taylor page for references. –Tommy Kronkvist (talk), 22:41, 2 May 2019 (UTC).

Common names (pages)[edit]

Is Wikispecies going to create pages for the common names, or is it Wikipedias matter? 20:15, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

No WS will not make separate pages for common names, as it is a site for taxonomy and classification only. However, there is a vernacular name section on the taxon pages, if required. Andyboorman (talk) 20:30, 4 May 2019 (UTC)
Sorry, to hear that. 11:45, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

Merge of double authority pages[edit]

While sorting the authority pages for their surname during the last days, I found many double pages for the same authority. I have put the pages concerning zoologists into Category:Pages to merge. Any help with checking and merging is appreciated. Kind regards, --Thiotrix (talk) 07:43, 7 May 2019 (UTC)

After merging, please remember to merge the related Wikidata items (see d:Help:Merge), or at least let someone here know that that needs doing Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:49, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


{{BibForm}} is marked as "long since deprecated", yet has 868 transclusions. Are there any plans to remove it? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:14, 9 May 2019 (UTC)

It's less than that: it's only directly transcluded on reference pages.
For context (since I assume very few people have used it), this template is mostly a roundabout way to auto-create the {{aut}} formatting and the link to the template page. It has a companion {{BibForm1}} that can generate the "find all Wikispecies pages which cite this reference" link. Circeus (talk) 15:17, 11 May 2019 (UTC)
{{BibForm}} is currently used by a total of 145 reference templates and {{BibForm1}} by 148. In my opinion using the two templates together is counterintuitive, and also quite often the backlinks created by them are malformed or otherwise rendered in a non-standard way. Give me a few days and I will have emptied them both, replacing them with the standard Wikispecies format. Simply using {{subst:Reftemp}} directly in every reference template is a lot easier and more convenient, since it creates all backlinks and automatically adds them to Category:Reference templates.
Tommy Kronkvist (talk), 13:21, 17 May 2019 (UTC).


{{Author}} (created by our no-longer-active colleague User:AryamanA in 2015) has just 290 transclusions; and simply applies the author category to taxon pages; it seems it can simply be subst: like this.

Applying the category in a template in this manner makes it invisible to HotCat, so it cannot be easily changed if the category is renamed or a duplicate category merged.

Could someone run a bot to subst: all instances, so the template can then be deleted? Would anyone object to this? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:26, 9 May 2019 (UTC)

Reference template[edit]

We have an agreement how to create a reference template. I see now persons who making reference template not after the agreements. See Template:Andrews,RC, 1908 PeterR (talk) 12:11, 11 May 2019 (UTC)

Peter, this kind of public callout is entirely unwarranted when it's quite obviously a copy-paste error when creating the template. Circeus (talk) 15:26, 11 May 2019 (UTC)
Thanks Circeus. I hope that this copy-paste error is over now PeterR (talk) 07:50, 12 May 2019 (UTC)


I have created {{Eponyms}} and {{Eponyms by person}}, and am using them as I migrate categories from "Patronyms of..." to "Eponyms of...".

For example, see this category page and this author page.

Feel free to join in. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:33, 12 May 2019 (UTC)

Good idea. Using "patronyms" creates linguistic conflict with East and South Slavs. In those cultures, patronymic refers to one's middle name and means 'son of' or 'daughter of'. It is referred to as such on Russian passports. Eponym will remove confusion.Neferkheperre (talk) 22:53, 12 May 2019 (UTC)
@Neferkheperre: I agree. Also, "patronym" (and of course "matronym") are gender specific terms, whereas "eponym" isn't. –Tommy Kronkvist (talk), 03:42, 16 May 2019 (UTC).
Very well done. From there I also learnt to use the gadget cat-a-lot. Thanks.--Hector Bottai (talk) 22:09, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
@Pigsonthewing: Good initiative Andy! I went ahead and created the {{Eponymy}} sister template which works in the same way as {{Eponyms}}, except for the wording. –Tommy Kronkvist (talk), 03:42, 16 May 2019 (UTC).
Why? How does having two templates for the same purpose help us? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:35, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
While some people may prefer one wording, I agree there is no justification for using two different section titles, and even less for using two different templates! Circeus (talk) 19:47, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
My reason for creating it was the one mentioned by Circeus: some people prefer using "eponymy" instead of "eponyms", just as they may prefer "synonymy" over "synonyms". Then I realised that since we don't have a {{Synonymy}} template to accommodate that user preference, we might as well skip the {{Eponymy}} one as well. Hence it's now deleted. Tommy Kronkvist (talk), 13:57, 17 May 2019 (UTC).
If we can't have variant citation styles, then we sure as hell aren't going to have this sort of pointless variation. Circeus (talk) 20:26, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

On archaea[edit] (koavf)TCM 20:55, 15 May 2019 (UTC)


I have been updating the above genus and below is lift from the Discussion Page.

The traditional sectional circumscription (Dudley, 1964) is not supported by either morphological or molecular evidence and should be removed pending further research Li et al. (2015) & Sˇpaniel et al. (2015). This is particularly important due to the many new nomenclatural combinations, mainly in the re-established Odontarrhena (77), but also Meniocus (6) and the monotypic Resetnikia gen. nov.. Andyboorman (talk) 09:05, 14 May 2019 (UTC)

In addition, Rešetnik et al. (2013) has found that although there are some morphological synapomorphies distinguishing A. sect. Alyssum, A. sect. Gamosepalum and A. sect. Psilonema, none of the sections are monophyletic. The sections are of minor importance in understanding lineages, relationships and taxonomy within Alyssum s.str. and will be removed unless there are reasoned arguments for their retention.

Comments before I go ahead with my proposal. Andyboorman (talk) 15:15, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

Talk pages consultation: Phase 2[edit]

Category:New genus-group name 2014[edit]

A few years ago we have desided to cancel Category:new genus-group name etc. I see a lot of these categories on the pages. When is these transaction finished? PeterR (talk) 08:33, 18 May 2019 (UTC)

A list of these can be seen at Category:Names. I can depopulate and delete them if there is consensus to do so. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:33, 18 May 2019 (UTC)
Andy. there a lot more Categories: new genus; new species etc. All these can be delete. PeterR (talk) 15:12, 20 May 2019 (UTC)
@PeterR: No, there are no categories named Categories:New genus or Categories:New species etc. Which others have you found, except for the ones that are listed in Category:Names?
@Pigsonthewing: Andy, I agree with PeterR. All of those Category:New genus-group name 1817 (...1827, 1837, 1916, etc...) categories should be deleted, as we decided several years ago.
Tommy Kronkvist (talk), 02:39, 21 May 2019 (UTC).
I've emptied and deleted all those that were in Category:Names, but found a bunch more under Category:New genus group names. I'll work my way through them when I have time. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 13:43, 21 May 2019 (UTC)
Please give link to conversation where this was decided years ago. Neferkheperre (talk) 14:43, 21 May 2019 (UTC)
I found one, but no consensus reached. Burmeister (talk) 14:53, 21 May 2019 (UTC)
Oh yes, I remember that now. looks like most people were either neutral or hinging in favor at the time (I know I wasn't strongly opposed, my main concern was that the two codes work priority in very different ways). Most of the debate was focused on what structure to give the category tree. Circeus (talk) 15:24, 21 May 2019 (UTC)

Other superfluous categories[edit]

I'm spotting a bunch of unneeded stuff, much of it leftover from Stephen's unilateral work. I remember trying to do work on the higher categories years ago, buuuuuuuut getting talk about this stuff is almost impossible and I was not confident enough to just boldly berserk my way through it until people started complaining.

Circeus (talk) 15:24, 21 May 2019 (UTC)

category:Original combination/Subsequent combination may be of some use to botanists; category:Primary types exactly duplicates information in our Repository categories, and primary type information, including catalog numbers where known, should be listed in Name section of taxon pages. Yes, any subspecies categories should be merged into species-group categories, to make consistent with genus-group and family group categories.
Valid names categories are nothing more than lists of taxon pages, and of little use. Invalid names categories sound of more use to botanists. I can see some use for some of the name status categories for special purposes, such as Conserved Names, nomen nuda. Gender mismatches are not much issue at all, and incorrect spellings are usually typos, and are sufficiently noted attached to reference citations. Neferkheperre (talk) 20:26, 21 May 2019 (UTC)
Except even without having looked at them I'm 80% sure the "invalid names" are all really in the ICZN sense, i.e. just synonyms that shouldn't even have pages. Circeus (talk) 02:46, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
category:Original combination/Subsequent combination is not useful to botanists, as it uses the wrong terminology. "Basionym" is the correct botanical term for "original combination". --Franz Xaver (talk) 13:16, 22 May 2019 (UTC)


Since only thing which seems to be agreed upon so far is that no definite agreement was ever reached, think maybe we can stop removing entries until we do reach one? If we do agree to keep them, we will have to put them all back. Seems kind of unilateral. Neferkheperre (talk) 12:42, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

Not sure you have got that one right. There seems to be agreement here and in the past that most, if not all, of these categories are not required, superfluous and so on ...Their removal will certainly not produce a Wikispecies Lite, I feel. Andyboorman (talk) 17:58, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

Don't delete please[edit]

Some users here are all too zealous to go ahead and delete categories en masse. I suggest cooling down a little before starting to delete. Especially please don't delete the following categories:

I gave the reasons for their existence several times in detail and I'm tired of repeating my claims again and again. Just be more considerate and wait to reach a consensus before starting any harsh action. Mariusm (talk) 17:50, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

"Some users here are all too zealous to go ahead and delete categories en masse. I suggest cooling down a little before starting to delete." Really, Mariusm? I acted in good faith on a request made by an editor in good standing, who reported that consensus had already been reached, only after waiting three days to see whether there were any ojections (as can be seen above, there were none in that time), and for another editor in good standing, whoa also reported prior consensus, to second the request. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:11, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
Mariusm, all the times you "gave the reasons for their existence" that I can locate are you arguing alone vs. everyone else involved in the conversation and the only reason people haven't done anything is that literally tens of thousands of pages are involved and they preferred to add content. Believe me, I would have felt no remorse whatsoever rampaging through it all with AWB, but I'm lazy. Circeus (talk) 19:47, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
I am with the rampagers here. This should be a site of taxonomy not category. Andyboorman (talk) 00:37, 23 May 2019 (UTC)
I can see the value in the accepted and controversial name categories but why would we categorize species by being extinct or extant? —Justin (koavf)TCM 00:41, 23 May 2019 (UTC)
As far as fossil taxa are concerned, some subdivision as to Eocene, Oligocene, etc. is very useful for those trying to track down identifications, etc. This rampaging periodically takes on appearance of unilateral behaviour. Discussion @Burmeister: linked did not reach any real consensus as to publication year categories, although some alternatives and formats were presented. None were voted on. This type of result seems to be normal here. Lively discussion followed by dwindling. Is interesting that sudden desire to just start up mass deletions happens two years after last discussion. Why this delay?
If people are bored, then please help link pages to Wikidata (to do list). Apparently almost nobody is doing this when they create pages here. I go on the todo list and link up 30-40 per day, in addition to my own page creations. In spite of this, list grows by up to 50 per day, and is now above 3300. Help would be nice. Lots and lots of entries in Uncategorized Templates and Wanted Categories to solve. Neferkheperre (talk) 01:31, 23 May 2019 (UTC)
"This type of result seems to be normal here. Lively discussion followed by dwindling. Is interesting that sudden desire to just start up mass deletions happens two years after last discussion. Why this delay?" because except for the occasional timely case, getting any kind oc actual consensus on issues that don't directly impact how a page looks is FAR harder than herding cat. I also tried to ge a handle on the multiplying institution abbreviations years ago, remember? I was basically screaming into the void about it. Circeus (talk) 15:15, 23 May 2019 (UTC)
@Circeus: don't be so eager to remove the hard work of others. Unfortunately the automatic tools are providing you with the means to easily do so while the indifference of the others helps this transpire. @Pigsonthewing: I wish you quell your ire with boxing or judo and not on WS. You're sure to oppose everything I say just for the sake of opposing. Mariusm (talk) 15:21, 23 May 2019 (UTC)

Link formatting in reference templates[edit]

Is there any reason that links in reference templates (for example {{Nonveiller, 1996}}) are marked up as:

[,_1996 reference page]
[{{BASEPAGENAMEE}} find all Wikispecies pages which cite this reference]

which renders as:

reference page
find all Wikispecies pages which cite this reference

and not as:

[[Template:Nonveiller, 1996|reference page]]
[[Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:{{BASEPAGENAMEE}}|find all Wikispecies pages which cite this reference]]

which renders as:

reference page
find all Wikispecies pages which cite this reference

The former including the "external link" icon, the latter not? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 15:09, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

Because {{subst:reftemp}} appears to be programmed that way. Neferkheperre (talk) 15:34, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
Thank you; I understand the mechanics fully, but want to know why the decision was made for them to be this way. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 13:54, 23 May 2019 (UTC)
This goes way back to the very first edit of the template when {{Reftemp}} was first created by Stho002 in early May 2012. I don't know why he decided to format the template using full URLs instead of pure wiki code. I propose that we now change it using Andy's latter example since it's cleaner, shorter, and more legible. –Tommy Kronkvist (talk), 14:28, 23 May 2019 (UTC).