Talk:Apioideae

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Apium[edit]

Isn't Apium the type of this subfamily? DCDuring (talk) 20:30, 16 August 2013 (UTC). Yes done Andyboorman (talk) 13:00, 22 March 2014 (UTC)
Downie et al (2010) assigns a number of genera to clades not formal taxa. These have been left off of this circumscription for now, as some admins do not favour cladistic nomenclature. Updates ought to be sought where available. In addition, in another paper (Magee et al, 2010) they break up Subfamilia Saniculoideae producing Apioideae s.l. in order to deal with basal lineages. Perhaps this ought to be included? Andyboorman (talk) 13:00, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

Does any source provide type information for taxa for any subset of taxa? Tropicos is a good readily accessible source of type information. [1] It is not complete but a good start. Andyboorman (talk) 10:30, 23 March 2014 (UTC)
To what do we now assign those genera. DCDuring (talk) 20:14, 22 March 2014 (UTC). I notice that work since 2010 has chipped away at the clades, but it is minor. I suspect there will be a rash of papers in the next year or so! Magee's paper has a circumscription for the protoapioids, I have just added Annesorhizeae as a start. Do you want to finish this? This still leaves numerous genera not in tribes! They are not incertae sedis, but Unassigned Genera I guess. Messy to say the least. Perhaps ask the advice of somebody more expert like Kempf EK (talk), Stho002 (talk) or post a message on the pump. Not much help sorry! Andyboorman (talk) 10:30, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

To say that the classification of this sub-family is a mess is somewhat of an understatement! Clearly the tribes are more or less monophyletic by now, but many, if not most, of the major genera in these tribes are para- or even polyphyletic! There is a plethora of small genera, including a lot of mono- and ditypic genera, whose circumscription is often based upon seemingly minor morphological features. This may or may not be appropriate the jury is still out. There is a possible move to subsume genera into larger 200+ species 'generic swarms' where appropriate to achieve monophyly. In addition, many natural clades are still not recognized in a Linnean system as tribes, sub-tribes or even clearly defined genera, which does not suit WS policy. Major changes to generic circumscription are overdue and hopefully will occur soon. In the mean time, I will tidy up a few easy lose ends, as I move on to other tasks! It is worth noting that common genera such as Angelica, Peucedanum, Heracleum, Pimpinella and most North American endemics are still not monophyletic and require major re-circumscription either by 'lumping or splitting'. Finally, all secondary sources (books, The Plant List, GRIN, NCBI, Tropicos etc.) are wrong to a greater or lesser extent. Andyboorman (talk) 08:56, 6 May 2014 (UTC)